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ivan zhao

T2 · manager / operator

Co-founded Notion, went through two major refoundings (Kyoto 2015, Cancun 2023), transformed Notion from a struggling SaaS to an AI-native productivity platform with ~1000 employees and 50-60 former founders on team via acqui-hires.

6 calls·1 name·100% bull·last heard 4 months ago·Sequoia Capital
track record

no scored calls yet — needs a stated position or a categorical verdict, with a matured window vs SPY

top calls

highest conviction · one per company
1sthigh conviction
$NOTIONNotionposition

GPT-4 access triggered religious-experience refounding at Notion

Early GPT-4 access in Cancun was a 'full body religious experience' that convinced Zhao and co-founder Simon Notion must become AI-native despite internal skepticism, leading to a painful 1.5-year agent-building slog before model improvements unlocked revenue inflection.

Sequoia Capital2026-05episode →

most discussed · click a bar to filter

  • $NOTION

recurring themes

  • AI Applications1
  • Enterprise AI Adoption1
  • AI Talent & Labor Market1
  • Venture Capital1
6 total
$NOTION
Notion
MEDivan zhao·Sequoia Capital·4 months ago·Notion’s Ivan Zhao: The Refounder· position
Notion cracks enterprise sales by pairing system-builder CRO with hunter VP
After failing to invent a novel PLG-only sales motion, Notion hired GitHub's Erica as CRO (system thinker) paired with PVesh (rah-rah hunter), respecting the classic enterprise playbook while layering AI tools for efficiency.
"our CRO is Erica's one she was CRO of GitHub before it's a system thinker right we pair Erica with our head of sale PVesh which is the rah rah like the meat eater... perfect pairi…"
56:30
$NOTION
Notion
HIGHivan zhao·Sequoia Capital·4 months ago·Notion’s Ivan Zhao: The Refounder· position
GPT-4 access triggered religious-experience refounding at Notion
Early GPT-4 access in Cancun was a 'full body religious experience' that convinced Zhao and co-founder Simon Notion must become AI-native despite internal skepticism, leading to a painful 1.5-year agent-building slog before model improvements unlocked revenue inflection.
"GBD4 is a religious experience for me. It's like holy It's a it's a full body religious experience. Like you have to do something with this. This is what change everything."
34:12
$NOTION
Notion
HIGHivan zhao·Sequoia Capital·4 months ago·Notion’s Ivan Zhao: The Refounder· position
Notion CEO details AI-first refounding: brewing beer not building bridges
Ivan Zhao argues building with LLMs requires a fundamental shift from deterministic 'bridge-building' to probabilistic 'beer-brewing' product development, forcing Notion to merge design/engineering/PM roles, hire for agency/taste over experience, and restructure marketing/sales around speed and AI-native workflows.
"building classic software is like engineer bridge if you can design it you usually can build it fairly predictable... building with language model back then and somewhat still is…"
3:23
$NOTION
Notion
MEDivan zhao·Sequoia Capital·4 months ago·Notion’s Ivan Zhao: The Refounder· position
Notion eliminates CMO role, splits marketing into storytelling and demand gen
Notion abolished its CMO organization, replacing it with two decentralized units: storytelling (embedded with product for rapid shipping) and demand gen (serving sales), arguing traditional marketing cannot keep up with AI-accelerated product cycles.
"We actually changed our marketing department. We no longer have a CMO organization... We break up our CMO organization into storytelling... which is closer to product... and the o…"
15:34
$NOTION
Notion
MEDivan zhao·Sequoia Capital·4 months ago·Notion’s Ivan Zhao: The Refounder· position
Notion acquires 50-60 founders via acqui-hires to prevent calcification
Notion intentionally acqui-hires founders as 'decalcified meathead machinery' to inject entrepreneurial energy, giving them platform leverage to pursue their original domains (e.g., enterprise search, AMO) without fighting for product-market fit.
"We intentionally do a lot of acquisitions. We have 50 60 founders at notion... founders are are kind of this kind of like little decalcified meatthead machinery just trying to bre…"
39:00
$NOTION
Notion
HIGHivan zhao·Sequoia Capital·4 months ago·Notion’s Ivan Zhao: The Refounder· position
Notion adopts barbell hiring: junior ICs + senior architects, cuts middle
Notion shifted hiring to a barbell of very junior ICs (high agency/curiosity) and senior architects who provide taste and manage AI-augmented teams, de-emphasizing mid-level experience as LLMs commoditize coding capability.
"we're hired for much younger people okay internally we're call like IC early out of school IC... the shape it's not it's more like the barbell barbell shape right because the seni…"
11:11
9
AI Applicationstailwind
LLM product development is probabilistic brewing, not deterministic engineering
Building with LLMs requires 'brewing beer' experimentation (evals, iteration, taste) rather than 'bridge building' spec-handoff, fundamentally changing org structure, hiring criteria, and planning cycles from quarterly to weekly.
8
Enterprise AI Adoptiontailwind
SaaS refounding playbook: AI-native orgs: merge roles, barbell hiring, decentralize marketing
Notion demonstrates a repeatable pattern for SaaS→AI transformation: collapse PM/design/eng into unified builders, hire junior+senior barbell for AI-augmented leverage, replace CMO with product-embedded storytelling + demand gen, and accept gross margin compression as cost of AI differentiation.
8
AI Talent & Labor Markettailwind
Capability commoditized by LLMs; hiring shifts to agency, taste, curiosity
As LLMs democratize coding/writing capability, Notion optimizes for immutable traits: agency (will), taste (value system), and curiosity — hiring early-career ICs for throughput and senior architects for direction, creating a barbell that outperforms traditional senior-heavy teams.
7
Venture Capitaltailwind
Refounding stuck SaaS companies: listen to body, embrace wartime, acquire founders
For sideways SaaS companies, Zhao advises drastic refounding (shrink, relocate, rebuild) when 'body tells you so,' noting current market dynamics are wide open; acqui-hiring founders injects entrepreneurial energy that prevents organizational calcification.